User talk:Dfoplayer

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Archive 2 From May 2014 to June 2015
Archive 3 From July 2015 to September 2015

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Hey Dfoplayer. Would it be okay if we use mathematical estimated expressions like this for certain skill growths? The amount of time and effort spent updating these pages becomes heavily taxing after a while. Also, it's very difficult to manually update each value when every new rework patch changes all the values anyway.

Right now, the only problems with this I see are that the values aren't exactly precise, and it becomes incredibly clunky with certain skills with multiple values like Flash.

Altair (talk)

Yes. I would not mind it.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. Due to table visibility issues, Bah Wikier and I have been discussing on his talk page about changing the skill growth table format on the SkillPage to a SkillAttribute List of expressions.

Considering User:Everspace's suggestion about omitting non-changing information in tables and the fact that we are now using 'non-changing' mathematical expressions, it may be more beneficial to use a list format.

If it's okay with you, we will be issuing this as the new makeshift standard for the skill growth section.

Altair (talk)

If you are suggesting to put the new list

*{{SkillAttribute|Level|n}}
*{{SkillAttribute|Lv Req|80+2(n-1)}}

in |SkillGrowth= section, then I'm fine with it.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. I just had an idea.

Out of curiosity, do we have a loop extension installed and would it be possible to construct a skill table from a #while loop extension?

Here's an example I had in mind using the skill:  Quick Punto

{{#vardefine:maxlv | 50 }}
{|{{SkillTableHeader}}
!Level
!Lv Req
!MP
!Melee Atk.
!Lance Tip Atk.
|-
{{#vardefine:i| 1 }}{{#while:
| {{#ifexpr: {{#var:i}} <= {{#var:maxlv}} | true }}
| <nowiki />

|-
| <!--Level--> {{#var:i}}
| <!--Lv Req--> {{#expr: 1+2*({{#var:i}}-1)}}
| <!--MP--> {{#expr: 6+0.568*({{#var:i}}-1) round 0}}
| <!--Melee Atk.--> {{#expr: 781+79.273*({{#var:i}}-1) round 0}}% + {{AbsoluteDamage| {{#expr: 1.95+0.198*({{#var:i}}-1) }} | 1 }}
| <!--Lance Tip Atk.--> {{#expr: 1027+104.273*({{#var:i}}-1) round 0}}% + {{AbsoluteDamage| {{#expr: 2.57+0.261*({{#var:i}}-1) }} | 1 }}

{{#vardefine:i| {{#expr: {{#var:i}} + 1 }} }} <!--Incrementation-->
}}
|}

Ideally, this would create a table and output 50 rows for the skill. I'm not that good at MediaWiki coding, but would this type of implementation be possible?

Altair (talk)

I looked into this weeks ago when you asked me the first time, atleast trying to find some way for mediawiki to calculate mathematical formulas. We do not have loops installed. I asked the site owner sometime ago because of your timeline and she replied we need to see if Extension:arrays can be substituted. Shown below, the while loop does not work

{{#while:

| true
| 

• 0

}}

However, I did not know we had variables installed, so combining arrays and variables should definitely looked into. It could solve some more problems!

I'll try to do some work on the weekend...

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. It has come to my attention that individuals who are trying to create an account on this wiki are being blocked by some strange Internal Error dealing with some "AntiSpoof.php" extension.

I've tried this myself, and I seem to get the same error.

Altair (talk)

I have informed the site owner.

Dfoplayer (talk)

It is now working. Please inform the new volunteers that they can now help update the wiki!

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. I'm working on some navigation templates on my User Page. I was wondering if you could provide some feedback about them, particularly on usability and readability.

Altair (talk)

The readability is fine for my screen. The small text keeps it nice and tidy in my opinion.

Of course manually entering new NPCs will be troublesome down the road. So a more efficient way of doing it is to modify the Template:NPCs to add metadata on location. Then using semantic wiki, you can auto generate the navigational template tablwe, since we have the extension enabled.

It is different from DPL, as we have in Template:SkillNav. That one uses categories, and creating 15 categories in the form "<town> NPCs" is probably a hassle.

Do the same metadata with the dungeons template and auto generating the list should be a snap.

---

However, in terms of usability, dungeons navigational would be more useful. How many users are going to go from one NPC to another NPC? I see myself looking at NPCs from quest line or maybe skill learning.

With dungeons, I see myself jumping to the next dungeon page after I level up a couple times.

---

I don't mind the Lore navigational template. However, the fifth text note is overlapping on the hiddenTextHeader. Fix it by adding |height=5 to the Template:Note Row in section |Row1={{note row

Dfoplayer (talk)

I added semantics so we should be able to query locations now.

Example

Dfoplayer (talk)

Sorry for the late reply.

Okay, I'll get around to updating those pages on Monday. I need to finish leveling my Specialist to Lv90 first, since maintenance is tomorrow.

Altair (talk)

Sorry to bother you again. I'm not that good at Semantic Mediawiki coding. Is there a way/code to exclude certain dungeons from showing up in the list, like removed dungeons, with the inline queries?

Altair (talk)

Most definitely.

First, I want to know how is "Removed dungeons" labeled. If we can re-use, say a "removed" category, we should be able to #ask Semantics to filter. {{#ask: [[Category:!Removed Content]] }} If not, we need to create another property. Can you give me an example of removed content?

---

On the subject on improving the nav list, add |sort=Has dungeon entrance level requirement to your #ask, as shown in my EtchASketch. The Grand Flores list now matches the one on page "Category:Grand_Flores_dungeons" instead of alphabetical order.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Thanks for the reply.

The best example would be Time Gate. If the Removed Content filter is applied then Black Crusade, Tangled Time Gate, and Time Break should not appear.

Altair (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. How do you add class names to the left side menu list of the Wiki site?

Altair (talk)

That's reserved for admins only. Which classes do you need?

Dfoplayer (talk)

Demonic Lancer and F. Priest

Altair (talk)

Done.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Thank you.

Altair (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. Could you add Agent to the left side navigation as well?

Altair (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. Does this wiki have some kind MediaWiki extension for timelines? I was wondering if we could use it for listing/organizing critical events in the in-game lore.

Altair (talk)

Something like this? TimelineTable

Dfoplayer (talk)

Thanks for your reply.

Something like that is very good, but it might need some changes.

It needs to span over a period of 1000+ years. I'm just worried that the timeline will try to list out the years individually instead of organizing them into a larger group such as "centuries".

Also, due the massive span of events, I'm concerned that it may affect the visibility/readability of the event text as well.

Altair (talk)

This one might work EasyTimeline, but I rejected it because of of the interesting wiki syntax needed.

For something that says "Easy", you need to define colors and all other sorts of information to get it right. example. Editing Ebrahim's page will show you how complex it is.

If you would like to learn, we can ask to get it

Dfoplayer (talk)

Yeesh, that is quite complex. Though, I wouldn't mind learning this.

I'm not too worried the color syntax or multi-dimensional layering. I only seem to require its one-dimensional vertical timeline features as shown in the first EasyTimeline example you posted.

If you can get this, I will be very grateful.

Altair (talk)

The site admin recommends we try to use normal mediawiki code, as this extension for one page might be overkill.

If you can find a template for timelines, that would be nice. I will also search for one.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Got it to work.

Here is my example

There may be some issues, as i went through way too many edits to get it too work. But for now, this time line should be good. The last number does not print, and i probably won't look into the mathematics into why for sometime.

Dfoplayer (talk) WORKING TIMELINE

Thank you so much for your hard work.

I will get to working on this as soon as possible.

Altair (talk)

Need help on putting one of skill name "Divine Punishment" one of Inquisitor's 2nd Awakening, but this redirected to Male Sader's Ascension page instead.

EDIT: I just put Divine Punishment (Inquisitor) for now until we can fix to remove redirect from Ascension.

Aero X 999 (talk)

Okay. We could modify the page 'Divine Punishment', put a Disambiguation on it and show two links to the classes?

Dfoplayer (talk)

Why not just move the page to the original name, and delete the latter page? The original name isn't being used anyways?

Arrol (talk)

Oh I see what you are saying. It is done.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Alright, thanks. So I just finished setting up all new FPriest skills in there.

Aero X 999 (talk)

Requesting for to archive older event notes from year of 2016 on home page. Thanks in advance.

Aero X 999 (talk)

Yea, we can do that.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Thanks again!

Aero X 999 (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. Would you happen to know if there is a Spoiler's template somewhere in the Wiki?

Altair (talk)

No, I don't think we have those yet. Feel free to import Mabi wiki. This is for sections and This is for the whole article.

Just replace the icon with ours.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Alright, thanks for the info and the links. I added the Template to the wiki.

Altair (talk)

Sorry for asking a noob-ish question but I'm having a hard to find and how to make a "table" for class skills, I am planning to type in these skills for both Demon Lancer subclasses.

Aero X 999 (talk)

A table as in under the category "skills" in the page Vanguard? In this case, just create pages with the template Template:SkillPage and it should auto generate those tables.

If you wanted to a table with columns, (level, required level, Mp/Hp usage, skill attributes), then follow Helm Shot's SkillGrowth section when you edit it.

Dfoplayer (talk)

I just made a page, Quick Punto Shot for Demonic Lancer, not sure if I did right or not; but just explain me bit more so I can understand more.

Aero X 999 (talk)

It's good, but we need to move the "category" from the title. Then we should add the "Category: Demonic Lancer Skills" page.

EDIT: It will take awhile for the wiki to detect the new skill, so you won't see it in the Demonic Lancer page, but it does show up in the nav of Helm Shot.

Dfoplayer (talk)

I made another one but wrong title, so I don't know where the place I can start the page in correct one.

Aero X 999 (talk)

Ok, I finished adding all Demonic Lancer skills and uploaded its icon. Also just did first 3 skills to Duelist and its icon for now, I'll finish the rest of Duelist skill and its icons and Vanguard skills later. But I'm sorry I had to leave you some work to put these skills I just added into correct place, I'm still bad at this one.

Aero X 999 (talk)

When you create a new page, it is unnecessary to include "Category:" in the title. Just put the skill title after "http://wiki.dfo-world.com/view/". An example would be "http://wiki.dfo-world.com/view/Swirling_Spear". Since this is "Category" page, I can not move it, so we just copy and paste the skill into a new page, and delete the previous one.

Dfoplayer (talk)

It's from dpl returning a blank due to certain queries not returning anything. This then automagically renders into a p tag.

I remember being annoyed at this earlier.

-- Everspace (talk)

I'm not sure what you're talking about?

Aero X 999 (talk)

Don't worry about it Aero.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. With the last patch on June 28th, some of the Otherverse dungeon rooms were reworked. Should we keep the old information or delete it?

Altair (talk)

We should probably delete it.

Dfoplayer (talk)

While I'm updating the pages, is it all right if I make the pages less subjective? The strategies I've read are a bit opinionated.

Altair (talk)

Yes, feel free to.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer, sorry to bother you. Does the wiki have some kind of type attribute for HTML gallery that enables a slideshow or slider? I thought it would be pretty interesting organize certain images on NPC pages such as sprites and portraits in them. Also, I was thinking on uploading some of the comic cutscenes, and I thought a slideshow/slider would make it easier to read.

Altair (talk)

Yes, there is an MediaWiki extension. While it is possible to allow CSS support, the image tag, <img>, is disabled. Also, CSS only allows a set number of images, so I will ask if admin to install the extension.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Use this as a guide to the options. A sample would be Female Mage

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey thanks. But, the slideshow seems to be hovering over the Class Navigation and Item Template. Would it be possible to fix that?

Sorry for not being specific earlier, but I was wondering if the user could navigate through the images at will rather than relying on a transition timer such as shown here or here.

Altair (talk)

I think I know what you are talking about. Are these similar to your vision? Bootstrap carousel. Mediawiki slider1 and mediawiki slider2. Most of wikia's extensions can not be imported into MediaWiki, unless someone wrote an equivalent tool.

Do note that these automatically transition to the next photo. Fortunately, we would need to remove the auto transition code located somewhere in the JS file.

Finals are coming up for me, but if anyone wants to experiment with JS and CSS, by all means...

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey thanks for responding. Yeah, those references work. Personally, I don't mind the Bootstrap Carousel example. It's quite easy to use and traverse though the images in and out of order.

As for the automatic transition, I have not quarrel with it as long as they are not too fast. I am aware that it can be manipulated in the Slideshow extension. My main concern with the JavascriptSlideshow extension was that it didn't enable users to freely move back and forth through the images. The extension only enabled forward, backward, or random transition.

Don't worry about this though. It's not a crucial issue. It's just something to sate my curiosity and my understanding of the wiki's capabilities. Sorry for troubling you.

Altair (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. In the All in One update, they added another function to the quest line, Storybooks. I was wondering if we should cover this on the wiki or even where to put them. Technically when activated they function similarly to side quests and grant reward gold and exp upon completion. Should I categorize them under Quests?

Altair (talk)

If it acts like a side quest, then yes. Categorizing them under Quests is probably the best thing.

Dfoplayer (talk)

What should be done with pages like Leather Armor, is it fine to nuke them from orbit? Every single item is unavailable in our version, and it's highly unlikely they'll ever return.

Gardios (talk)

If the items are gone from the game, then yes, we should remove the tables.

We could leave the page itself here, and then use Semantics to generate the lists so its easier to find. Otherwise, the player would have to type in the exact item name in the search box. If that's the case, can Semantics produce a level range, like armors between lv 10 and 19?

Dfoplayer (talk)

My current plan for the armor pages was to create armor weight+slot pages like List of cloth tops, have semantics create the armor tables on those pages and then link to them from the main armor page. I don't think having it all on a single page is a good idea, Scythe is already super long (and that's without chronicle gear!), and that times 5 is... kinda insane.

Gardios (talk)

Ahhh. Alright. Nuke away then. Be sure to mark any old images.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Actually, is there any need to have these pages as two separate pages? Since I'm already doing overlay images with the map segments and NPC icons, it seems to me that I can just overlay the NPC icons on top of the map segments. Since there's not much ways to get to the NPCs Map page aside from the Main Page link, whereas every single NPC points back to the town they are at, which in turn can link back to the Town Maps. If anything, I can also overlay NPC icons on top of each individual town's maps. I think this would work better than what we have right now.

If you're okay with this, then I will go ahead and start making these changes, which will lead to eventually migrating everything off the NPCs Map page and then deleting it.

JunEcho (talk)

I can even use tabs on the Towns page so that there is an NPC-less version and a with-NPC version map for each Town Map, so that people can choose whether they want to click on locations or NPCs.

JunEcho (talk)

Actually, I always envisioned having images overlaid on a bigger map image. I haven't had the time to figure it out, so this is great. Whichever one you are currently working on, you can mark the other page for deletion. Make sure you fix the links as well.

For tabs, I don't think it would be a good idea. Just have the images overlaid. It will make it easier for users to click on the map right away.

Dfoplayer (talk)

I actually figured this out by looking at how the wiki already had overlaid Blank images over the dungeon location map screenshots on each of the older towns. I just took that idea and instead of overlaying a blank image (which is silly anyways because the size is never accurate) I overlay the actual dungeon banners that we already have: the way DFO does it in-game. Since that worked out, I took that to the next level and tried it on the NPC MiniMapIcons we already have and overlaid it on the Town Maps. And ta-da~ it can be done :D

JunEcho (talk)

Is it possible to increase the value of $smwgQMaxSize? Even after some optimization, the default value of 12 makes it currently hard to search for certain things using the Equipment query — the default size for every query is 4, the most expensive filter Armor (without specifying slot or weight) bumps the size up to 10, which makes it impossible to further filter by stats (+2 to 3), skill bonuses/alterations (+3 to 5) or all skill bonuses (+3 to 7). Setting $smwgQMaxSize to 17 should probably be enough since there shouldn't be a reason to specify the search much further and unlike Armor, the other category filters only have a size of 2.

Gardios (talk)

I will ask the site owner and keep you posted.

Dfoplayer (talk)

All right, thanks!

Gardios (talk)

The site owner had finals this week. She said she would try to change it this weekend. How do we know if the size has been updated, without her confirmation? Do we just run a query?

Dfoplayer (talk)

Pretty much.

{{#ask:
{{#arraymap:1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12|,|@@@|[[@@@]]|}}
|format = debug}}

If you preview that, it will explicitly tell you the size of the query. You can just try appending more numbers and if you get an error and the query size doesn't increase anymore, you've reached the current maximum size.

Gardios (talk)

The size has been updated to 17.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hi Dfoplayer. Sorry to bother you but can you change Abunova to Abnova on the main page? It has been bothering me for quite a while now XD Thanks!

JunEcho (talk)

You can actually change it through Template:Newmenu. I can do it right now, however.

Dfoplayer (talk)

I see. Thanks!

JunEcho (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. I'd like your opinion on the Epic Quest format for Vilmark - Area 50 (Epic Quests). I added the Hidden Text Template to the dialogue to minimize space. I also added a section for Dungeon Maps for scenario dungeons (if necessary). How does it look? Does it look too clunky? Is it user friendly? Is it too overwhelming? I was thinking about surrounding the quests in the Hidden Text Template, but some of my friends said it was gratuitous.

Anyway, I'm just concerned on what the standard should look like before I start editing on a large scale. I have most of the information ready to input from Abnova to Time Gate. I'll probably have Power Station information ready in two weeks.

Altair (talk)

It's good to minimize space, and I would just leave it like the way you have it. I'm not sure if we need the dungeon map for the non-noted quests, such as "To Prevent Another Incident" or "Collecting Terranite."

Dfoplayer (talk)

I understand your point. However, I only add notes about Quest Item drop rates, APCs, or helpful hints/strategies. I feel there could be certain scenarios where the notes would be unnecessary such as straightforward clear the dungeon quests. The dungeon map still may be necessary for completion.

In the cases of Vilmark - Area 50, City of Noire Ferra, and Reshpon Village of Pain, the dungeon map pretty much stays the same, so it seems a bit redundant. But in actuality, it may differ from the actual dungeon. (<- I may have to review my notes on the quests.) Special Dungeons are an exception to this. I could remove the maps on those two aforementioned quests and put a note stating that the map does not change for the rest of the quest line; if that helps.

However, in most major epic quest lines, scenario dungeons alter the map to fit the objective. Most don't require notes. For the most part, I recommend that we should keep the maps for consistency reasons.

Altair (talk)

For consistency reasons, I see your point.

If we start to use the table method of dungeon maps, we should think about a template. Over at Mabinogi Wiki, they place everything in Data Templates, which is then used in DataFormat Templates. This allows them to reuse the data in any page. Someone here does not like in-line css.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Makes sense. Manually using the table method could result in some pretty messy and extraneous code.

As a suggestion for the template, it could take in as parameters the number of rows and columns. Then it could fill in spaces with image files of corresponding map sections from the given tuples locations. These images probably would include:

• End Points: , , ,
• Straight Path: ,
• Corner Point: , , ,
• 3-Way Junction: , , ,
• 4-Way Junction:
• Boss:
• Empty:

Altair (talk)

Yes. Hopefully we can find a template someone already created on the internet.

Dfoplayer (talk)

I would look to semantic holding a "map", and then {#ask:}ing for it.

The whole DataTemplate thing gets really cyclical real quick, and a pain in the ass to debug or use outside of those templates. I was hoping to transition from that, over to semantic which does all the things we want much easier.

-- Everspace (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer. I was wondering if there was an existing "Back to Top of Page" template on the wiki. I think it would be pretty nifty to have; especially with long pages such as Antwer Canyon (Epic Quests).

Altair (talk)

Yup. It's possible. I'll look into it.

EDIT: I added a floating css "back to the top" on my talk page on bottom right hand corner. How does it look? Need color changes? background color? Feel free to experiment in "inspect element" of firefox or chrome.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Yeah, that looks great! Thanks. I'll test for color/background changes later. I'll probably look into putting a small box with a border around it with 25% Transparency to make it slightly easier to see. I'm still looking for a good color, one that doesn't look to bland or too bright to be distracting. I'll probably go with Beige #f5f5dc or WhiteSmoke #f5f5f5 or Lavender #e6e6fa to match the wiki's colors.

Altair (talk)

Yea, what we could do is use this example. The box is on the bottom right.

Once we decide the formatting, I suggest we make a template called {{BackToTop}} and we place that into any long pages.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Maybe we can use a format similar to this: Clickable Button Template

Altair (talk)

I would like to work on css and making nice buttons and stuff, but I haven't had the chance and the bigger fish to fry (like Semantic Wiki and SkillTemplate) have taken up my actual time...

-- Everspace (talk)

That is very interesting. I'll try to apply it to my Talk page.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Alright. We are now live. Template:BackToTop. Go ahead and place {{BackToTop}} where ever you see fit.

Dfoplayer (talk)

Hey Dfoplayer, do we keep removed skills such as  Massive Countdown or  Twin Gunblade on the Class Skills Template or do we change the class name to something like N/A on the Skill Page Template to make them not appear or just place the Removed Content Template? I'm worried that keeping old skills on the class skill pages may confuse users.

Altair (talk)

For now, just add the Removed Content Template. I will discuss this with Everspace.

Dfoplayer (talk)

I just implemented the new SkillPageTest. Check it out on  Massive Countdown. Any thoughts?

Dfoplayer (talk)

I think it looks good. Should the other categories stay, just wondering?

Arrol (talk)

Well, the reason why Category:Cube Skill and Category:Cancelable Skills shows up is because we are using the template in "Attributes" section. The rest of the categories can be seen in the infobox on top right, and SkillPage would auto fill in the wiki code for us.

Personally, I think we just need Category:Removed Content. Otherwise, if the someone were to navigate to Male Mechanic Skills Category, they would see Massive Countdown.

Dfoplayer (talk)

oh I see.

Personally, this category was long needed. It's good to have them around still for nostalgia's sake, I just wish we could've saved the older skills instead of deleting them.

Arrol (talk)

Not necessary. If the webmaster did not clear out cache, then I can restore some pages from mediawiki's recycle bin. I just need to look through the deletion logs, which could take sometime due to the old icons floods...

Dfoplayer (talk)

Alright. It's been added to the main skillPage. If you see any Removed Skills, go ahead and add the parameter "|RemovedSkill=Yes" and it will auto fill in the template:RemovedContent.

Dfoplayer (talk)